TX-NR709 network initializing issue

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:08 pm

Hello,

I have the following problem with my TX-NR709.

If I have the network cable plugged in:
Selecting NET or USB inputs causing the device to get stuck in an endless "Initializing network" state after 7 dots come up on the screen. It will stay there forever and never work. You can select other input (such as cable) and still get sound, but the network and USB functions never work. You can access the web server on the receiver from a computer on the network, so I know the IP address is working (tried both static and DHCP).

If the network cable is not plugged in:
Network and USB inputs work normally. Of course, there is no network connection so you can't access any services. However, the screen with the services does come up correctly.

I have tried updating to the latest firmware, power cycling, and factory resets. I have exchanged it for a new device, but it does exactly the same thing. This has the same symptoms as the issue that was resolved last year on the NR708 (albeit I do not have a 708).

The connection is to a Motorola surfboard cable modem/router. I have tried different cables (including known working ones). All the other devices on the network can access the internet perfectly. Both the DHCP and static IP settings are correct.

I have contacted tech support already, but they have no ideas (other than update firmware, power cycle, and reset). Seeing as this exact issue has occurred on several models, this must be a firmware issue. How do I get this resolved?

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  Smittylube on Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:24 am

If your sure your cable goes to the www try in menu- hardware settings - network and be sure and select wired and not wireless.
That seemed to work for me where wireless failed.
This is a fantastic rx when you get it figured out.

Even the iPhone 2 app works stellar!

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:43 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I Apologies for the inconvenience, have you contacted Motorola on this at all as it sounds like it may be a setting and or firewall in the router that is blocking the wired access to the network.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Wed Jan 25, 2012 2:00 pm

Wired and wireless access through the router/modem is perfectly fine for all other devices. I have no less than twenty devices on the network (wired and wireless), and they all perform flawlessly. The 709 is the only one that has a problem.

I assume it is an issue with the 709 connecting to the internet, since I as said before you can access the 709 web server via its IP address on the internal network. Unfortunately the 709 provides no feedback on what it has an issue with. It just gets stuck "initializing".

Now if there are firewall settings other than the standard gateway, dns server, and subnet mask that are needed please let me know. Your documentation says nothing about that.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:17 pm

Hi jmeiners,

You mentioned that you "tried" to do the firmware update, did it complete successfully if not did it give an error code? If it did complete successfully what is the firmware that you have now on the unit? This will help with the resolution of your issue.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:53 pm

The firmware update completed correctly when performed via USB (with network cable unplugged).
It is running 1091 0977 0210 9105

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:17 pm

Hi jmeiners,

That seems to be an older firmware version the latest version is as follows:
1111-1077-0211-1105

This is from 12/20/2011

If you can try to download the firmware using a wired connection..
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Thu Jan 26, 2012 2:30 pm

I just updated to that version via USB (network update does not work). Same exact issue, no change at all.

BTW, "Now initializing" stalls at 6 dots (not 7 I said previously). I don't know if there is any significance to that.

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Same "Now Initializing..." problem for me here.

Post  itsmefd on Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:54 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I experienced the same exact issues you described. Here's what I've gone through:

TX-NR709 #1:- I have a D-Link DIR-655 router with about 25 devices connected to it wired/wirelessly. No issues on any of the devices that are on the network.
- Network function was working fine for a week, then suddenly the TX-NR709 no longer could be found through the Onkyo2 iOS app. I could ping and log onto the receiver's webpage by IP address, but the Onkyo2 app couldn't see the receiver. If I turned the receiver on in NET mode to listen to Pandora (which worked previously), it would just show "Now initializing…" and go through a few of the square progress bars and eventually freeze, although if I switched to other modes like my PS3, the receiver would be ok.
- I attempted to update the firmware through the network (I have a wired connection to the receiver), but as soon as I got to the Update screen (where you're supposed to press Enter on the remote/receiver so it'll update), it would never respond. I even left it on that screen overnight not knowing what it was supposed to show.
- I called Onkyo Support who told me to reset the TX-NR709 by pressing the VCR and Power button. This cleared all my settings. Then I tried to update the firmware with the support rep via the network which didn't work, so we then tried by USB which didn't work either. The support rep said the TX-NR709 I received from Amazon was defective and to return it.

TX-NR709 #2:- Amazon was great and overnighted me a replacement TX-NR709.
- The first thing I tried was to update the firmware through the network. It took a few tries but for some reason it worked and I had the latest firmware installed in about 30 minutes. Nothing on my network had changed.
- After about a week or two, I ran into the same issue as the first TX-NR709 where the networking functionality stopped working. I did notice that between this model and the first model, the serial #s were only a few digits off, so maybe Amazon got a bad batch or something. I returned the second TX-NR709 to Amazon and decided to upgrade to the TX-NR809.

TX-NR809:- The first thing I did on this receiver was update the firmware as well. This went without a hitch on the first try.
- So this receiver has been working great for about 3 weeks, but last week it had the same problem as the 2 TX-NR709s.
- I reset the receiver last night and tried to listen to Pandora but it would just get stuck at "Now initializing…" and the Onkyo iOS app no longer can find the receiver either. When there's no network cable connected to the Ethernet port, the receiver usually will display the list of Internet stations within about 20-30 seconds (and then indicate there's no network connection).
- I'm about to return the TX-NR809 to Amazon and be done with Onkyo, but I'm going to try a few more steps before I do:
- Run a packet sniffer on the network to see what the Onkyo is doing.
- Connect the receiver directly to the Internet and bypass the router.

What's puzzling in all of this is why the receivers work for a few weeks and then suddenly no longer will work no matter what. I wonder if it matters that I'm on a gigabit network? I've searched for the 709 and 809 issues on the avsforum discussions for these issues and have seen other people encounter the same problem we are experiencing with no solution (although 1 user switched his router to a different brand and said it fixed the issue). I'm leaning more towards there's a problem with the Ethernet port or firmware on the Onkyos.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:04 pm

Yes, I agree their must be some issue with the Onkyo firmware. They need to get someone on their software team to look at it. It would help if the receiver gave some sort of error code or dump.

It will be interesting to see what you find with the packet sniffer.

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Packet sniffer didn't turn up much

Post  itsmefd on Fri Jan 27, 2012 2:57 pm

Surprisingly my receiver works again. I ran a packet sniffer last night to see what the receiver was doing and there wasn't much activity I could see. It just looks like the receiver tries to make an external connection and then stops. I put the receiver on the router's DMZ and was able to connect to Pandora. Once that worked, I confirmed I was able to use the Onkyo app to adjust the 809 as well. Then I took the receiver off the DMZ and it continued to work.

Have you tried to put the receiver on the DMZ on your router or just bypass your router to see if it makes any difference? There were other settings on my router like SPI (Stateful Packet Inspection) and Anti-Spoof that sometimes cause issues with IP devices. I did not disable those during my testing.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:19 pm

Hi itsmefd,

Yes, there are many different settings on routers may or may not make this connection work or not work. It is always best to contact the router manufacturer if there are any doubts. Thank you for bringing this to the forefront.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:42 pm

That is actually kind of funny. Onkyo phone tech support said the same thing.

Exactly WHAT settings would the Onkyo device not work with (when all other devices are fine).

What am I supposed to ask Motorola support? Gee, I have an Onkyo receiver which can't connect to the internet even though every other device I have connects just fine. Can you please tell me what settings the Onkyo receiver might need? What do you think they are going to say!!!!

Don't try to pawn this problem off of someone else. It is an Onkyo issue. Now if there are settings I can apply to my router to make it work, I would be perfectly happy with that. But NO ONE but ONKYO can tell me what settings the receiver requires.

This would be simple if there was some way to get a log from the receiver indicating what is failing. Surely you have some sort of diagnostic ability?

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:19 am

itsmefd,

Thanks for the suggestion on the DMZ. I tried that and it seemed to get further in the "now initializing" process before locking up. I power cycled it 4 times (pulling the plug) and each time it went for a different amount of time before locking up. Once it did pull up the screen with Last Fm, Pandora, etc but then immediately locked up (Net started flashing that time).

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:33 pm

Hi jmeiners,

Just curious, if you bypass all of your routers and switches and run it direct to the modem will it work then just as a test. If this is too much trouble then the only thing at this point is suggest it be either taken or sent to one of our authorized service centers to have a technician look at it.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:46 pm

The cable modem and switch are integrated. The 709 already goes directly to this. I did try putting the switch on the DMZ (see above), but it did not resolve the issue.

Why do you think the switch is defective? I already had it replaced once and they both do exactly the same thing.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:07 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I have no idea whether the switch is bad or not it was a simple test to see if something in your network was causing the 709 to not connect and it appears that nothing in your network is causing it. So as previously stated I would have a service center take a look at the receiver to determine what is going on there.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  itsmefd on Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:35 pm

Hi jmeiners,

One other thing that I'm sure the Onkyo techs probably have suggested is to reset your receiver (which I don't recommend because it did nothing for me). This is a major pain in the a** since you'll have to set up everything again, including Audyssey.

But maybe the Onkyo Tech that has been corresponding with you may have some insight as to how to complete perform a complete factory reset if he/she is still reading this discussion.

In the past when I've done the reset that's mentioned in the manual (Power + VCR) button, I've noticed that my network settings and Pandora account still remain in the receiver. My understanding was this reset would wipe out everything and return the receiver back to its initial state, but this is not the case. For example, if you typed in the Onkyo's IP address into your web browser, you'd hit the Onkyo 709's page. If you changed the settings to a static/manual IP address instead of DHCP, you'll see that if you do a factory reset and go back to the Onkyo's IP address, your static/manual IP address that you entered will not clear from the receiver. I saw the same behavior resetting the receiver and then attempting to log onto Pandora. My Pandora email and password were still saved. There has to be some place in the receiver that's storing this information, perhaps in some flash or NVRAM that is not getting refreshed/reset.

One thing I remembered from my packet sniffer is the router would sense there was some device using an IP address and send out a message for the device to identify itself. Something like "who is using IP address 192.168.0.40?" But I never saw the Onkyo respond to this request. My thinking is the Onkyo grabs the IP address from the router but then for some reason doesn't acknowledge that it has that IP address and is looking for another one. Like it gets assigned the 192.168.0.40 address, but thinks it got a 192.168.0.41 address. So the Onkyo is always listening for requests on the 192.168.0.41 address but in reality it has been assigned the 192.168.0.40 address (perhaps the Onkyo caches this information and doesn't clear the cache).

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One more thing to try

Post  itsmefd on Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:44 pm

Hi jmeiners,

One other thing I can think of is to switch your internal LAN IP address to a different set of numbers to see if this does anything to the Onkyo. For example, if you're using 192.168.0.XXX, change it to 192.168.1.XXX. Your other devices won't work while you have this switched over temporarily but at least you can see if the Onkyo grabs the new series of numbers.

I'm trying to help you since I myself spent over a month pulling my hair out with the 709 (and 809) getting this to work and I know how frustrating it is! I saw someone on the AVSForum switched to a different router which worked for them. From my understanding your router and modem are in 1 unit (like a 2Wire?).

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:31 pm

itsmefd,

Thanks for your help Smile

Yes, I use a motorola surfboard integrated modem / wireless / wired switch. Generally it is pretty problem free. It does make bypassing things a moot point though. I'll look around in it's config to see if there is a way to emulate that (shutdown all other functions).

I think I'm going to need to get a packet sniffer and see what I can find. I'll look at it when I get back home next week.

What I really need is a real technical document from Onkyo that describes what the switch is trying to do (from a network perspective). The support playbook of update firmware, unplug, reset, replace just isn't cutting it.

Onkyo, don't you have another tier of support that can do real technical debug?

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:04 pm

Hi jmeiners,

If you go into the setup and go to hardware then firmware update and try to download the firmware using the net option does it connect, if not what error message is it giving? This information will be useful. Thank you.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:07 pm

It does not give an error. It just gets stuck on the firmware update page forever. I would leave it there for 24 hrs, then power cycle it and do the update via USB (with no network cable attached) instead.

If the network cable is attached, USB firmware update would also not work. It would not read the USB device. Seems like the USB and network stacks are somehow tied together.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  OnkyoUSA on Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:18 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I appreciate the quick response. Just as a test can you disconnect the Ethernet cable and USB (if there is one connected) from the back and try the firmware update again via the net option? This should actually give you an error code.
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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  itsmefd on Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:46 pm

Hi jmeiners,

Any MAC filters enabled on your Motorola? If yes, have you added the MAC address for the Onkyo?

Does your Motorola list the Onkyo as a DHCP client (if you are using DHCP)? If yes, can you revoke the IP address from the Motorola and have the Onkyo attempt to obtain a new IP address? If the Onkyo does not attempt to try a different IP address, can you first reserve the IP address on the Motorola (so the Onkyo doesn't get the same IP), and then let the Onkyo connect by DHCP again?

For the DMZ, did you put the Onkyo's IP address on the DMZ? There's one post that you mentioned you put the switch on the DMZ rather than the Onkyo (which I suspect you may have just meant the Onkyo, but wanted to make sure).

UPnP - Do you have this enabled on the Motorola? Can you temporarily disable this?

That's all I can think of for now. Let us know how it goes.

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Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners on Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:19 pm

I'll try these on Saturday when I get back.

itsmefd,

MAC filters are not enabled. I am using static IP right now (verified the ip address, subnet, gateway, and dns servers). DHCP seems to work fine as well (insofar as getting the IP address).

On the DMZ, I did put the static IP for the 709 (192.168.1.89) on the DMZ.

I do have UPnp enabled. I'll try turning it off.

Thanks again Smile



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