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TX-NR709 network initializing issue

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isturiz
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itsmefd
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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  jmeiners Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:46 pm

The cable modem and switch are integrated. The 709 already goes directly to this. I did try putting the switch on the DMZ (see above), but it did not resolve the issue.

Why do you think the switch is defective? I already had it replaced once and they both do exactly the same thing.

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Post  OnkyoUSA Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:07 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I have no idea whether the switch is bad or not it was a simple test to see if something in your network was causing the 709 to not connect and it appears that nothing in your network is causing it. So as previously stated I would have a service center take a look at the receiver to determine what is going on there.
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Post  itsmefd Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:35 pm

Hi jmeiners,

One other thing that I'm sure the Onkyo techs probably have suggested is to reset your receiver (which I don't recommend because it did nothing for me). This is a major pain in the a** since you'll have to set up everything again, including Audyssey.

But maybe the Onkyo Tech that has been corresponding with you may have some insight as to how to complete perform a complete factory reset if he/she is still reading this discussion.

In the past when I've done the reset that's mentioned in the manual (Power + VCR) button, I've noticed that my network settings and Pandora account still remain in the receiver. My understanding was this reset would wipe out everything and return the receiver back to its initial state, but this is not the case. For example, if you typed in the Onkyo's IP address into your web browser, you'd hit the Onkyo 709's page. If you changed the settings to a static/manual IP address instead of DHCP, you'll see that if you do a factory reset and go back to the Onkyo's IP address, your static/manual IP address that you entered will not clear from the receiver. I saw the same behavior resetting the receiver and then attempting to log onto Pandora. My Pandora email and password were still saved. There has to be some place in the receiver that's storing this information, perhaps in some flash or NVRAM that is not getting refreshed/reset.

One thing I remembered from my packet sniffer is the router would sense there was some device using an IP address and send out a message for the device to identify itself. Something like "who is using IP address 192.168.0.40?" But I never saw the Onkyo respond to this request. My thinking is the Onkyo grabs the IP address from the router but then for some reason doesn't acknowledge that it has that IP address and is looking for another one. Like it gets assigned the 192.168.0.40 address, but thinks it got a 192.168.0.41 address. So the Onkyo is always listening for requests on the 192.168.0.41 address but in reality it has been assigned the 192.168.0.40 address (perhaps the Onkyo caches this information and doesn't clear the cache).

itsmefd

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty One more thing to try

Post  itsmefd Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:44 pm

Hi jmeiners,

One other thing I can think of is to switch your internal LAN IP address to a different set of numbers to see if this does anything to the Onkyo. For example, if you're using 192.168.0.XXX, change it to 192.168.1.XXX. Your other devices won't work while you have this switched over temporarily but at least you can see if the Onkyo grabs the new series of numbers.

I'm trying to help you since I myself spent over a month pulling my hair out with the 709 (and 809) getting this to work and I know how frustrating it is! I saw someone on the AVSForum switched to a different router which worked for them. From my understanding your router and modem are in 1 unit (like a 2Wire?).

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Post  jmeiners Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:31 pm

itsmefd,

Thanks for your help Smile

Yes, I use a motorola surfboard integrated modem / wireless / wired switch. Generally it is pretty problem free. It does make bypassing things a moot point though. I'll look around in it's config to see if there is a way to emulate that (shutdown all other functions).

I think I'm going to need to get a packet sniffer and see what I can find. I'll look at it when I get back home next week.

What I really need is a real technical document from Onkyo that describes what the switch is trying to do (from a network perspective). The support playbook of update firmware, unplug, reset, replace just isn't cutting it.

Onkyo, don't you have another tier of support that can do real technical debug?

jmeiners

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Post  OnkyoUSA Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:04 pm

Hi jmeiners,

If you go into the setup and go to hardware then firmware update and try to download the firmware using the net option does it connect, if not what error message is it giving? This information will be useful. Thank you.
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Post  jmeiners Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:07 pm

It does not give an error. It just gets stuck on the firmware update page forever. I would leave it there for 24 hrs, then power cycle it and do the update via USB (with no network cable attached) instead.

If the network cable is attached, USB firmware update would also not work. It would not read the USB device. Seems like the USB and network stacks are somehow tied together.

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Post  OnkyoUSA Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:18 pm

Hi jmeiners,

I appreciate the quick response. Just as a test can you disconnect the Ethernet cable and USB (if there is one connected) from the back and try the firmware update again via the net option? This should actually give you an error code.
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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  itsmefd Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:46 pm

Hi jmeiners,

Any MAC filters enabled on your Motorola? If yes, have you added the MAC address for the Onkyo?

Does your Motorola list the Onkyo as a DHCP client (if you are using DHCP)? If yes, can you revoke the IP address from the Motorola and have the Onkyo attempt to obtain a new IP address? If the Onkyo does not attempt to try a different IP address, can you first reserve the IP address on the Motorola (so the Onkyo doesn't get the same IP), and then let the Onkyo connect by DHCP again?

For the DMZ, did you put the Onkyo's IP address on the DMZ? There's one post that you mentioned you put the switch on the DMZ rather than the Onkyo (which I suspect you may have just meant the Onkyo, but wanted to make sure).

UPnP - Do you have this enabled on the Motorola? Can you temporarily disable this?

That's all I can think of for now. Let us know how it goes.

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Post  jmeiners Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:19 pm

I'll try these on Saturday when I get back.

itsmefd,

MAC filters are not enabled. I am using static IP right now (verified the ip address, subnet, gateway, and dns servers). DHCP seems to work fine as well (insofar as getting the IP address).

On the DMZ, I did put the static IP for the 709 (192.168.1.89) on the DMZ.

I do have UPnp enabled. I'll try turning it off.

Thanks again Smile



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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty network probs with TX-NR709

Post  delbarm Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:40 pm

I have probs myself with nr 709 on behalf of network. internet radio works fine, but I'm perfectly happy with my 2 FM radiostations ! problem is DLNA. when I stream music, I can't touch the volume (on device, on RC nor on android app), because then it crashes. in zone 2 I can control volume.
I don't know the right names, but this is all when I "pull" music out of NAS or PC, using the receiver with OSD. When I try to "push" music from NAS (by PC, android or Ipad app), it doesn't work at all. My Samsung TV works perfectly in any kind of those situations, so its possible. but not with Onkyo. not with current firmware.

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Post  OnkyoUSA Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:44 pm

Hi delbarm,

The reason it works with your TV is because it can take pretty much anything that's thrown at it. When you put a receiver in the mix it has to go through handshakes checks and it has to be allowed to get to the net via your router. Also everything in the mix is required by DLNA to be certified or it will not work. So what I'd like for you to try is the following:

1. Make sure that all components are DLNA certified
2. Make you have your router set to allow this function to operate. You may want to contact the router manufacturer and have them walk you through the setup.
3. Make sure your PC is DLNA certified.
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Post  delbarm Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:53 pm

thank you for your quick reply.

but :
1. Make sure that all components are DLNA certified CHECK like I said it works on my Samsung TV's software (pulling and pushing, like I call it), not to mention : it even works with a small portable internet radio

2. Make you have your router set to allow this function to operate. You may want to contact the router manufacturer and have them walk you through the setup. CHECK again. I forgot : playing locally stored music with the Onkyo app on my android phone (everything Onkyo) it works, so router is obviously OK. but receiver crashes as soon as I touch the volume on device or any button on app : crash. don't blame it on a perfectly good working device.

3. Make sure your PC is DLNA certified. don't bother. see above 1.

check how smooth Synology soft (+apps) and Samsung (+apps) work. Others face same protocols, so it's possible. handshaking, etc. is for them no problem ? hope you'll fix this soon.
networking is as I see it the next big thing for home audio. don't miss this train.

Mick




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Post  OnkyoUSA Fri Mar 09, 2012 1:30 pm

Hi Mick,

If this is the case then the unit will need to go to a service center for further evaluation. They can be found on the main page under support on our website. Thank you for choosing Onkyo.
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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty TX-NR3007 Initializing issue

Post  wolf Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:09 pm

I had similar problems with my receiver when trying to use the internet for music. Worked for a couple of months and then this same problem. But, no help from Linksys re the router and little help from ONKYO. However, for whatever reason, I unplugged the receiver and did not plug it back on until about an hour later. Then turned on the receiver but selected TUNER, then when that played I then went to the NET/USB selection and everything was there to use and listen to. I've used since but do not know whether unplugging helped or my habit now of selecting TUNER first and then going to the NET/USB button but it does work so I'll stick with that. Just do not want to find out if I can skip the routine, yet.

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Ran into this issue again - Now on my 809

Post  itsmefd Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:56 pm

The NET issue happened to me again, so I spent time going trying to find any new information and found on avsforum people were experiencing the same issue all of us are.

Seems the Onkyo has a hard time with some DNS issue which causes it to hang on the NET input. After disabling the Advanced DNS option on my router (which causes it to reset and get a new IP), I also unplugged the network cable from the back of the Onkyo and unplugged the power cord from the Onkyo to fully shut it off. I let it sit for a few minutes, then hooked the network cable back up and plugged the power cord back in. Left it on the BD/DVD input for a minute to give the Onkyo enough time to get an IP address from the router and now I was able to connect to Pandora again.

After using three different routers from two different brands, I was finally able to get a 4th router to try from a third brand (Cisco).
Eureka! I got it to work on the the Cisco and then I started comparing the Cisco (older router) to the newer (2) Dlinks and Linksys. It was a DNS issue with the router.

I was not aware of the new feature called "Advanced DNS" that is available on all of the new Dlink Gigabit routers... well maybe not all but at least the two I had. Furthermore, if you do a quick setup it is automatically enabled and a novice like me won't even notice it's there. I'm not much of a network guy but I saw that the DNS that was on the router status page were bogus when compared to my actual DNS from my ISP. I think its a security feature. Even when I set it up on the Onkyo manually, I would input the DNS server that I saw on the router. And when I allowed it to use DHCP it would just hang up for some reason. Why? I don't know, a computer network guy can probably shed light on that.

Anyway, if you are having trouble with the NET feature, this might work for you.
I went into some advanced settings on my Dlink router. Disabled "Advanced DNS" and its a Christmas miracle! I rebooted everything. It seems to work with Pandora, DLNA, the Ipad App, etc. I don't know what the feature is called on the Linksys but I am suspecting that they have the same thing perhaps under a different name. I'm not 100% sure as I don't have that router handy anymore.

So, if you have a newer router and are having loads of trouble, this may do it for you. I hope it does because I've been frustrated with this for a month now and I really hope I can save someone that frustration. Its my fault that I happen to just try routers with this feature on it but that's all I had available.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21395270#post21395270

or google "avsforum onkyo advanced dns" and it'll be the first result returned.

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Post  OnkyoUSA Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:42 pm

Hi itsmefd,

Thank you for the research and hopefully this will resolve some of the problems people were having.
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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty TX-NR509 with same issue: Now Initializing...

Post  isturiz Fri May 18, 2012 6:04 pm

My four month old 509 has to be unplugged/plugged at least once per day to reset it. After a random time of use, it simply locks up and simply says: Now Initializing...

I have upgraded to the latest Firmware, changed my switch, placed receiver in DMZ, changed my patch cords, tried connected with the wireless adapter.

NOTHING FIXES THE ISSUE.

It seems to be a firmware issue with the receiver. Any plans to address this?

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Post  OnkyoUSA Mon May 21, 2012 2:29 pm

Hi isturiz,

At this point I would advise a service center to evaluate it. Authorized service centers can be found on our main page under support.
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Post  itsmefd Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:00 am

isturiz wrote:My four month old 509 has to be unplugged/plugged at least once per day to reset it. After a random time of use, it simply locks up and simply says: Now Initializing...

I have upgraded to the latest Firmware, changed my switch, placed receiver in DMZ, changed my patch cords, tried connected with the wireless adapter.

NOTHING FIXES THE ISSUE.

It seems to be a firmware issue with the receiver. Any plans to address this?

It is an issue with the networking portion of the firmware which Onkyo does not acknowledge as an issue. They'll tell you first to update the firmware, then to reset the receiver to the factory default settings and then if that doesn't work then to send it to the service center which cannot reproduce the issue that many of us have reported. Or they will say it's your router, cables, ISP, etc that is the cause. My receiver gets an IP address without any issues and I can get to the receiver's web page just fine. It just can't connect to any streaming music via Internet or local network. Personally, I have just given up using any of the network functions on the receiver. I check from time to time to see if there are any updates to this, but since these are 2011 models, I doubt there will be any new firmware updates to fix this issue.

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Re: TX-NR709 network initializing issue

Post  marcustremonti Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:23 am

isturiz wrote:My four month old 509 has to be unplugged/plugged at least once per day to reset it. After a random time of use, it simply locks up and simply says: Now Initializing...

I have upgraded to the latest Firmware, changed my switch, placed receiver in DMZ, changed my patch cords, tried connected with the wireless adapter.

NOTHING FIXES THE ISSUE.

It seems to be a firmware issue with the receiver. Any plans to address this?


isturiz,

I had similar issues with my 509, among many other things. I had to send mine in to a service center because it was almost not usable. When I got it back 2 weeks later the work order said it had to repair multiple cold and open solders on the USB, HDMI and Sub Preout boards. Needless to say this was Onkyo's poor quality control and lazy construction and the service center(not affiliated but works with Onkyo) fixed all my issues and now it works better than it did 3 MONTHS NEW. I'm guessing this is probably your issue as well. However, get Onkyo to pay for shipping because this is their fault.

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Same issues with TX-NR808

Post  dtsdig Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:28 pm

I have had all of these same network issues since day one with my 808. It randomly just drops itself off the network and to get it to connect again takes a miracle. Yesterday I thought I'd attempt to install the firmware update that was released in March. As soon as I hit the button, it gives me "version error" messages and locks up. After cycling the power off and back on, it had dropped off the network. An hour later, after unplugs, resets, modem/router resets, ethernet cable unplugs and more power cycles I got it to once again connect to the network and was able to use Pandora. Once attempting to try and do the firmware update again, the same thing happens. When trying just to get the net radio functions to work again, I get other errors and it won't connect.
I've contacted Onkyo about my machine before through their customer service email and last week spoke with their support people. All they suggest is to send it to United Radio Service in Syracuse, NY. I worked for United Radio and want nothing to do with bringing my receiver there, not to mention it will be a three week turnaround at best. I'm so sick of the network issues with this machine. No other piece of network connected gear gives me hassle like this. Even trying to use the iPhone app, the machine will just randomly drop itself off the network and I won't be able to use the app. The unit is still under warranty but I just don't want to deal with the wasted time and money of a "return for service". I want it replaced.

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Post  OnkyoUSA Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:49 pm

Hi dtsdig,

If you've done all that and you say you used to work for United Radio then you understand our warranty policy. If our customer support reps determined your unit needs service and it has not been serviced already then you have to take or send it to a service center whether that be United or some other authorized service center. If you'd like to discuss this more in depth you may contact our parts and service department at 201-785-2600 option #4
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Post  marcustremonti Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:17 am

OnkyoUSA wrote:Hi dtsdig,

If you've done all that and you say you used to work for United Radio then you understand our warranty policy. If our customer support reps determined your unit needs service and it has not been serviced already then you have to take or send it to a service center whether that be United or some other authorized service center. If you'd like to discuss this more in depth you may contact our parts and service department at 201-785-2600 option #4


dtsdig,

I would suggest the service center I used to fix your issue........ http://www.ablserv.com

The turn around time from shipment to receiving it back was just under 2 weeks and they were in contact with me the whole time. Shipped it back extremely well-packaged and they were very competent(describing what solders were fixed on what boards). I say if you've lost all hope and have to have warranty work done, ship it to these guys.

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TX-NR709 network initializing issue - Page 2 Empty Network problems with NR509 and NR609 two weeks after July Firmware upgrade

Post  Barrie Hall Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:18 am

All,

It seems we are all having the same problems with NRx09 network functions on Onkyo equipment.

My story is nothing new. I can ping the two units I own, I can browse to their web pages but accessing the NET functions gives me either a blue screen or the dreaded "Initializing...."

Shortly after the upgrade I was able to use the DLNA functionality on both AVR's using the remote2 app on my ipad. Happy days. Two weeks later the app couldn't detect the AVR's.

As an experienced and senior software engineer, network engineer and Telco general manager I know a firmware problem when I see one.

I am fortunate enough to have network traces from the boxes both BEFORE the problems started and AFTER:

Simply put, both AVR's where sending UDP Muliticast packets to the correct mulitcast address for upnp:

Looks like this:

10:12:35.219382 IP pch.mypond.net.32905 > 239.255.255.250.1900: UDP, length 371

This is a upnp advertisement packet which tells a DLNA control point (remote2 app for example) how to talk to the Onkyo. This is correct behaviour.

Now, I am seeing this:

20:15:37.126654 IP dh-129.mypond.net.40418 > 239.255.250.250.9131: UDP, length 109

This is very odd. Both my 509 and 609 send out these packets. They are not recognized by anything on my network (I would not expect it too). These packets are advertising an H232 function (nothing to do with DLNA).

This is a bug Onkyo. Lets get it fixed.

(Yes I have tried the hard reset, firmware upgrade, etc, etc).

Regards,
Barrie







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